Macros under 8811 extender

[velocity]

I’m running the 8811 extender. I want to have two macro keys (M1, M2) turn my TV and Receiver on and off and, depending on which button is pressed, select which sat receiver to leave the remote set for.
To start, I used these macros:

M1 TV; Power; RCVR; Power; L1
(L1 runs a tested macro that sets up Receiver and TV and sat #1)

M2 TV; Power; RCVR; Power; L2
(L2 runs a tested macro that sets up Receiver and TV and sat #2)

My thinking is that the L1 and L2 macros won’t matter when the TV and Receiver are off
When they turn on, the L1 and L2 macros set everything up

But the receiver doesn’t switch to the right inputs. I think that it needs some time after power-up before it will listen to the remote commands. So, I set up a key move on the TV device and mapped Pause protocol (TV/1104) to TV shift -1. I put $02 in the hex location for 2 x 0.4 = 0.8 second delay

So now the M1 macro is:
TV; Power; RCVR; Power; TV;shift-1;shift-1;shift-1; L1

That should be tons off time for the receiver to power up and listen to the L1 macro but it doesn’t work. If I press the L1 key immediately after running the M1 macro, every thing is fine.

[gfb107]

Don't use the device buttons (TV, RCVR, etc) in your macros. Use the X_ temporary device selection buttons instead. From the readme.txt that came with the extender:

Temporary Device Selection:
---------------------------

Within a macro, you often want to issue a key to a specific device
regardless of the previous device selection and without disturbing that
previous device selection. You use X_ commands to do that. For example,
the sequence
X_TV; 0; 3
in a macro would send the 0 and 3 keys to the TV regardless of the previous
device selection.

The X_ selection is automatically canceled when the outermost macro (see
nested macros) completes. If the above example were intended for use as a
top level macro, there would be no need for it to explicitly cancel its X_
command. If the above example were in a general purpose macro that might
be called by other macros, you probably should change it to:
X_TV; 0; 3; X_Cancel

While an X_ command is active, it applies to all keys. The usual division
into Pip, Menu, Channel, Volume, Transport and Other doesn't apply.

.

[Talus]

I was just going to say that...

If you use the device seledtion button in the macro, and you have a macro assigned to that...well...you can run into problems.


Your macros should look liks this:

M1 X_TV; Power; X_RCVR; Power; L1

M2 X_TV; Power; X_RCVR; Power; L2

If you wanna get fancy and try what I did...use the device keys to turn on the devices you need to use that device, switch the receiver to that input and leave the remote in the 'mode' you need to operate that device.

[velocity]

I should have been more detailed in my previous post. The TV and RCVR entries were X_TV and X_RCVR. So next, I went to the L1 and L2 macros and changed the standard devices to X_ devices except for the final device selection of AUX and CBL. This didn't help me. As a last resort, I copied all the steps of L1 macro into the M1 macro and did the same for M2 (L2). Now both M1 and M2 macros work just fine. You just have to hold the remote poiniting at the system until the delays execute and then setup the receiver and TV inputs and outputs.

[firefighter12035]

If you wanna get fancy and try what I did...use the device keys to turn on the devices you need to use that device, switch the receiver to that input and leave the remote in the 'mode' you need to operate that device.

How did you do yours like that, what should the macro and keymoves look like, and how do you power off everything?

[gfb107]

firefighter,

You keep asking over and over what keymoves and macros should look like. You seem to be missing something about how they work together to get intended behavior.

Here's the basics:

1. Macros are just a sequence of key presses. If you can accomplish something by pressing a bunch of keys in a row, creating a macro that has those keys in the same order will accompilsh that same something by pressing just one key.
2. We use keymoves to add functions to the remote that aren't part of the normal operation of the remote. For example, the remotes don't have seperate Power On and Power Off keys, but many times your device does respond to seperate Power On and Power Off commands (we call these discrete commands because they perform one function and don't work like a toggle, which the Power command does).. In order to get the remote to send those commands, we much create keymoves for them. Once we have created those keymoves, they can be used in macros if desired. Note there are many devices that don't have discrete power commands, and there are other ways to handle that.
3. In the extender, there are special phantom keys (they can't be pressed on the remote, but they can be used in macros) for handling device selection on a keyset basis. These are the T_???, V_???, O_???, ... keys and are documented in the ReadMe.txt that came with the extender.
4. When using an extender the device keys aren't special in any way. They are automatically assigned macros that make them behave like device selection keys.
5. Input selection and power up/off macros are highly specific to your A/V setup, and we can't generally tell you exactly what yours should look like because none of us have exactly the same mix of components that you do. You'll have to do some experimenting, and if you need help with parts of it, ask specific questions.

[firefighter12035]

First of all Greg I understand that you are a expert in this field, I am not that is why I ask questions. You have to be somewhat of an expert to understand how to create the Keymoves and Macros. For some people like me it is easier and more understandable to see how somebody else's setup is. I do however have my control to do what I want it to. I don't know why it is so hard for some of you Experts just to answer somebodys Question instead of telling somebody to Read,Read,Read. Most of the Help Files that is written is for people that have more knowledge than others.

My Macros look like this example:
TV------X_TV;Shift-M3;P_TV;M_TV;C_TV;O_TV
SAT----X_TV;Shift-M1;X_Cancel;M_Sat;P_Sat;C_Sat;O_Sat
CBL----X_TV;Shift-M2;X_Cancel;P_CBL;M_CBL;C_CBL;O_CBL
That is all that I was asking for! Thanks for the help that I have gotten from everybody.

[Mark Pierson]

I don't know why it is so hard for some of you Experts just to answer somebodys Question instead of telling somebody to Read,Read,Read. Most of the Help Files that is written is for people that have more knowledge than others.

It's sometimes hard for us to "just answer" a question for someone who doesn't have a handle on the basics of JP1. Most of the experts were newbies at one point (though I'm convinced Rob and John Fine were born with remotes in their hands ). How quickly one absorbs all the ins and outs of JP1 varies greatly from one user to the next. We tell people to read so that they can at least skim the underlying principles of JP1.

I see you're using an extender. To steal a quote from Rob, "you need to learn how to walk before you can run". The point being that using an extender requires at least some advanced knowledge of JP1 concepts, notably macros and key moves. I agree that seeing how someone else has done things can sometimes "turn the light on", and there are some extender tutorials that help explain the process... have you read them yet? The What and Why of JP1 briefly touches on most of the required concepts. I know... yet another "read, read, read..." reply.

[firefighter12035]

OK I have read it over and over but I guess I'm stuipid because I just do not understand the concept of it.

"Macros are executed irrespective of which device on the remote is active
The data block for a macro is between three and seventeen bytes long. As with a keymove, the first byte of the header identifies the bound key and the low order nibble of byte 2 specifies how many bytes follow – in this case, the number of steps in the macro. Since a macro is effective for all devices, no bound device specification is included. The bit flag in the second byte will be 1 in the case of a macro. Since the macro length is specified by a single nibble, macros are limited to 15 steps. The form of a macro is shown below.

byte 1
key number of bound key

byte 2
$01
length of macro

byte 3
key number for the first step of macro

·

·

·
key numbers for up to

14 additional steps"

What does this tell me? Nothing because I don't know what it means. The only thing I wanted was to see an example of someones setup so I could learn from that. Instead I get Flamed because I ask to see it. Also I must not be the only one that does not understand it because I see a whole lot of other post asking to do the same thing as I wanted to do. But like I said I did get mine to do what I wanted,How I don't know but it is.

[Mark Pierson]

Instead I get Flamed because I ask to see it.

I don't think you were flamed. Greg and I were simply trying to help the best way we know how. If that's too technical for you, I apologize. Between what we've said and the readmes you've been referred to, everything you need to know should have been covered. I don't know what else I can offer to simplify it for you.

[gfb107]

Instead I get Flamed because I ask to see it. Also I must not be the only one that does not understand it because I see a whole lot of other post asking to do the same thing as I wanted to do. But like I said I did get mine to do what I wanted,How I don't know but it is.

You didn't get flamed, at least not by me. You kept asking to see macros and keymoves used to do things that I believe to be highly specific to a specific set of A/V components. Here's your entire question

How did you do yours like that, what should the macro and keymoves look like, and how do you power off everything?

Rather than just give you some macros and keymoves that most likely wouldn't make any sense to you, I was trying to get you to ask, "I am trying to do such-and-such. I've done this, this, and this, but I am stuck here."

Here are my power on and off macros, and the associated keymoves.

Macros:

Shift-Power: X_TV;Thumbs_UP;Thumbs_UP;X_AUD;Thumbs_UP;X_Cancel
XSHift-Power: X_TV;Thumbs_Down;X_AUD;Thumbs_DOwn;X_Cancel

Keymoves: (Device-Key : Move/Code EFC)

TV-Thumbs_UP: TV/0702 001
TV-Thumbs_DOWN: TV/0702 253

Is that information by itself helpful? I don't think so. You have no idea that for setup code TV/0702 (which comes from a device upgrade) EFC 001 is discrete on, and EFC 253 is discrete off. None of the other experts would probably have known that either, allthough they might have guessed that. Also, you can't see what is assigned to AUD-Thumbs_UP or AUD-Thumbs_Down because they are assigned functions inside a device upgrade and aren't visible as keymoves.

So you see that I was trying to get you to ask questions about what you didn't understand rather than just ask "how did you do that". I kept getting the feeling, since you weren't asking more specific questions, that you were stuck on one of the basic concepts (e.g. "what is a macro and what is one used for", or "what is a keymove and what is it used for").

If you had just said, "I'm looking for some examples of keymoves and macros", we would have provided that.

[mtakahar]

I should have been more detailed in my previous post. The TV and RCVR entries were X_TV and X_RCVR. So next, I went to the L1 and L2 macros and changed the standard devices to X_ devices except for the final device selection of AUX and CBL. This didn't help me. As a last resort, I copied all the steps of L1 macro into the M1 macro and did the same for M2 (L2). Now both M1 and M2 macros work just fine. You just have to hold the remote poiniting at the system until the delays execute and then setup the receiver and TV inputs and outputs.

Velocity, is it possible that you are using O_xx (or whatever a non-temporary device selection command) in the macros on L1 and L2?

X_ takes precedence to permanent commands during macro executions.

If this is the case, inserting X_CANCEL just before L1/L2 should work.

Another possibility I can think of is the delay being still not long enough, but perhaps you've already tried longer ones.


Hal

[firefighter12035]

If you wanna get fancy and try what I did...use the device keys to turn on the devices you need to use that device, switch the receiver to that input and leave the remote in the 'mode' you need to operate that device.

[How did you do yours like that, what should the macro and keymoves look like, and how do you power off everything?

If you had just said, "I'm looking for some examples of keymoves and macros", we would have provided that.

Greg I think that is what I had asked Talus to begin with not in that exact pharse but very close to it. And if you go and look at some of my other post I have asked that, but anyway thanks for any help that you have provided me.