What new extender feature would you like?

unclemiltie · Post by **unclemiltie** » Mon Apr 12, 2010 11:07 pm

The current crop of extenders (at least the ones that I wrote for JP1.3) are essentially ports of existing JP1 extenders to work in the new remote format. Yes, there are some interesting tweaks, but in general not a whole lot has changed since the 15-1994 extender was done years ago.

This got me to thinking: If there is something that you wished the remote could do but it can't rightnow, what is it? I'm not saying that it's doable or that I'd even take on that kind of a project, but...

have at it!

Post by **vickyg2003** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 6:32 am

The current JP1.2 extenders are a the 15-1994 extender without the FAV key.

The Flash remotes have way more possibilities than an EEprom remote. We've barely tapped the capabilities of these remotes. I'll be interested in any suggestions too.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 7:09 am

More device buckets in the Atlas 5 device remotes would be nice, with support for keymoves and macro keyset selection (V_Aux1 etc...)
(in other words, fully functional extra devices like Aux1, Aux 2 etc)

Being limited to 5 devices is the biggest drawback to these remotes IMHO...

I know you can use Multiplexing, but keymoves in the extra devices can't be handled this way.

These are nice remotes, with lots of memory space, but I like to devote the 3 "tune in" keys as extra "device keys", and without the extra buckets it's not as intuitive as it could be.

I realise you don't even get the keymoves bit of this in extenders like the 8910 which has lots of extra buckets, but, hey, you said ask...

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 7:37 am

Also, and here I don't claim credit for the idea, since I've already seen it suggested in the past, I'm just dragging it back up because I liked it, as a big user of LKPs.

The facility to define a particular device to use Shifted or X-Shifted keys as LKP targets for ALL of its keys, so that, if and only if, this option was set for that device, a short press would give the normal key, and a long press the (X)shifted variant. (or default back to normal if no shifted variant was set)

It would sure simplify some setups with lots of LKPs on one device.

I see a problem with "repeating" short key presses, though.

You could never repeat a short-side key of an LKP pair, and you'd have to bail out of checking for long press where no (X)shift target was set in order to repeat the normal key.

xnappo · Post by **xnappo** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 8:46 am

jimdunn wrote:More device buckets in the Atlas 5 device remotes would be nice, with support for keymoves and macro keyset selection (V_Aux1 etc...)
(in other words, fully functional extra devices like Aux1, Aux 2 etc)

Being limited to 5 devices is the biggest drawback to these remotes IMHO...

Agreed! I was trying hard to think what was needed and couldn't even get that to come to the surface because I am so used to it. Definitely the one thing that is making my Atlas IR files 'messy' is the lack of devices.

xnappo

Post by **vickyg2003** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 8:50 am

jimdunn wrote:More device buckets in the Atlas 5 device remotes would be nice, with support for keymoves and macro keyset selection (V_Aux1 etc...)
(in other words, fully functional extra devices like Aux1, Aux 2 etc)

Being limited to 5 devices is the biggest drawback to these remotes IMHO...

I know you can use Multiplexing, but keymoves in the extra devices can't be handled this way.

These are nice remotes, with lots of memory space, but I like to devote the 3 "tune in" keys as extra "device keys", and without the extra buckets it's not as intuitive as it could be.

I realise you don't even get the keymoves bit of this in extenders like the 8910 which has lots of extra buckets, but, hey, you said ask...

And that's the point, we can do ANYTHING with these FLASH remotes, its just a matter of how much work it would be. With the JP1.2 Comcast 3 device remote, the next 4 bytes after the setup buckets were for punchthough type actions that didn't apply when using the extender, so it was a minor job to use these as extra device buckets.

With the JP1.2 Atlas, you've got a lot of memory so it would be reasonable to do squeeze out more devices. With a complicated install like the comcast remote, I could convert the JP1.2 Atlas remote into a 10 or 15 device remote, although if it proved to be difficult I wouldn't be very motivated since I don't have more than 5 devices anywhere. The more devices you have, the fewer number of HT divisions you can use and I use those divisons a lot.

I don't understand your LKP suggestion, even though LKP is my favorite special protocol. I do however have some overly complicated devices that would require a lot of shifting to get these all loaded onto the remote. I ended up dividing these into "activity based upgrades" for the multiplex. So on my DVR if I'm watching a DVD, I have the DVD Player functions, however if I'm editing a DVD, I multiplex so that I have the keys I need available without having to access a bunch of shifted functions. Perhaps this kind of approach might be helpful in simplifying your setup. Of course that's not going to be particularly useful in setting up Special Protocols type keymoves

gfb107 · Post by **gfb107** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:14 am

I think he's requesting a feature that I once requested for a URC-6131 extender. The extender turns any long key press into a shifted key press.

See Using LKP instead of shift.

Post by **vickyg2003** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:18 pm

gfb107 wrote:I think he's requesting a feature that I once requested for a URC-6131 extender. The extender turns any long key press into a shifted key press.

See Using LKP instead of shift.

Ah, forget for a moment the way extender writers have to be so terse with their code in order to get it to fit, and the difficulty presented in finding a memory location to keep track the loop passes, and lets look at a few drawbacks to this type of operation.

1) Sluggish behavior. Its not going to do anything until after you lift your finger or have waited for lkp to timeout.

2) Problems for some equipment like my TV. When I want to change the volume I need to hold the volume key for quite a while before the volume menu comes up, and then the volume starts to change.

3) Counter intuitive for non-tappers. I tend to push the button until I see my equipment acknowlede the push and then lift my finger when I get some reaction like seeing the unit light up to let me know its received the signal. I'd have to totally retrained on remote operation to use this type of remote.

4) And the difficulty of getting a real LKP macro type key to press. You want Keymoves/macros/Favs to trump a normal keypress, but if you do these tests prior to the timeout, so that you can actually capture these, you have to repeat these tests if it was a long press. Dog slow.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:34 pm

gfb107 wrote:I think he's requesting a feature that I once requested for a URC-6131 extender. The extender turns any long key press into a shifted key press.

See Using LKP instead of shift.

Yes - that's where I saw it, long ago.

I understood the drawbacks, and I even alluded to them in the suggestion.

Still could be useful IMHO in some circumstances, but hey-ho.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 12:36 pm

xnappo wrote:
jimdunn wrote:More device buckets in the Atlas 5 device remotes would be nice, with support for keymoves and macro keyset selection (V_Aux1 etc...)
(in other words, fully functional extra devices like Aux1, Aux 2 etc)

Being limited to 5 devices is the biggest drawback to these remotes IMHO...
Agreed! I was trying hard to think what was needed and couldn't even get that to come to the surface because I am so used to it. Definitely the one thing that is making my Atlas IR files 'messy' is the lack of devices.

xnappo

Well that's 2 votes for that, then...

Maybe a few more will motivate the writers

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:01 pm

vickyg2003 wrote: I could convert the JP1.2 Atlas remote into a 10 or 15 device remote, although if it proved to be difficult I wouldn't be very motivated since I don't have more than 5 devices anywhere.

We have 8 in our lounge setup - so I still use an extended 8910 there -
but NO free memory anywhere with my complex setup...
(Here it is - probably a few bytes could be saved with a few redundant device selection commands at the end of device macros which I could remove, but there's not much more I could squeeze in. https://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... le_id=8277)

With extra device buckets on an Atlas it would be a breeze to replicate this - without it's much more complicated)

vickyg2003 wrote: The more devices you have, the fewer number of HT divisions you can use and I use those divisons a lot.

I don't understand that.

Are you saying that's a limitation in the programming - in that you use the registers/memory locations for HT in the extender, and adding devices would stop you doing that ?

If not, and you're talking about usage,I don't use, or see a need for any HT modes in general usage when you can set each keyset for each device in the extender - every device is a HT device.

Capn Trips · Post by **Capn Trips** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:26 pm

Count in my votes for:
(1) More device buckets in the Atlas 1056 - perhaps even permitting user-selected assignment of additional "device" buttons! Like maybe I want to assign additional "Devices" to the F1 and F2 buttons, but the next guy wants to use the A-D buttons for additional devices.
(2) ABSOLUTELY support making LKP automatically execute x-shifted functions as a user-selectable option. Acknowledge the difficulty associated with repeating functions, like Volume and Channel +/-, but perhaps one could make it assignable to a particular device+keyset combination, or even make it a user-selectable checkbox next to each button for each device in IR (again - maybe an advanced menu selection would show/hide this option to not overwhelm new users). i.e. you have a list of buttons for each device and simply check the checkbox for those functions you want to exhibit this behaviour.
(3) Can you program one button to blast a hyper-powerful IR laser signal from my remote (that would work through glass) that I can use to burn a hole through any vermin that may be soiling my yard? That would be really useful!

Not a lot of out-of-the-box thinking here, but I really like those earlier two suggestions.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:40 pm

Capn Trips wrote: (2) ABSOLUTELY support making LKP automatically execute x-shifted functions as a user-selectable option. Acknowledge the difficulty associated with repeating functions, like Volume and Channel +/-, but perhaps one could make it assignable to a particular device+keyset combination, or even make it a user-selectable checkbox next to each button for each device in IR (again - maybe an advanced menu selection would show/hide this option to not overwhelm new users). i.e. you have a list of buttons for each device and simply check the checkbox for those functions you want to exhibit this behaviour.

Thank you - you've eloquently developed what I was suggesting (which was Greg's old idea anyway - I just liked it enough to remember it !!!)

The point that would make it work for me is that it would be selectable - and the additional selection criteria you give would each improve its functionality - the point being, if a user wants it for a certain device/keyset/button (depending how granular it can be made) - they can activate it. Any limitations then become a trade-off for that user to weigh up.

jimdunn · Post by **jimdunn** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:51 pm

Capn Trips wrote:Count in my votes for:
(1) More device buckets in the Atlas 1056 - perhaps even permitting user-selected assignment of additional "device" buttons! Like maybe I want to assign additional "Devices" to the F1 and F2 buttons, but the next guy wants to use the A-D buttons for additional devices.

Wouldn't you only really need the buckets to be made available (with keymove functionality, macro keyset selection keys, and selectable in the General Tab of IR) ?

Then you can make any key a device key, just by putting a V_aux1;T_aux1.... macro on it.

Unless you're thinking of some additional functionality to set these macros up automatically via IR - which would be cool, too

xnappo · Post by **xnappo** » Tue Apr 13, 2010 2:05 pm

jimdunn wrote:
Capn Trips wrote:Count in my votes for:
(1) More device buckets in the Atlas 1056 - perhaps even permitting user-selected assignment of additional "device" buttons! Like maybe I want to assign additional "Devices" to the F1 and F2 buttons, but the next guy wants to use the A-D buttons for additional devices.
Wouldn't you only really need the buckets to be made available (with keymove functionality, macro keyset selection keys, and selectable in the General Tab of IR) ?

Yeah, this is right. The device keys are already nothing special in most extenders...

xnappo